Unlike your comment.

I’d say no. But as I said before I “shocked and awed” at what the Bush administration wanted to and did do, blatantly ignoring this:

Fourth Amendment – Protection from unreasonable search and seizure.
The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized.

If it was against the law to drink alcohol on the street, and the penalty could involve a trip to the holding pen, then yes. I and any normal person would say the same thing.

“Would you be telling the outraged Japanese public they should shut up and follow the law in other countries?”

Oh man, this is a trick question, right? And the correct answer would be what – “If you are a tourist or foreigner local laws do not apply to you”? I thought extraterritoriality was a notion discredited back in the late 19th century! Of course you have to follow the local laws, buckwheat!

“Or would you agree that it’s an overreaction on the part of the police and never should have happened?”

You can probably guess my retort by now…

“On a train in Italy I saw a Japanese family being fined for not having stamped their ticket. Guess it’s entirely their fault for not knowing all the rules, right?”

And in your world it would not be their fault? What Utopian anything-goes planet did you just alight from?

Looking at “Have your say”, the readers raise some good points.
http://search.japantimes.co.jp/cgi-bin/fl20090825hs.html
HANS BRINCKMANN　says

・・・・
the behavior of the police officers at the Shinjuku police box must surely be considered an exception. After all, there hardly is a country where one feels more safe on the streets than Japan・・・・

PHILIP ZALESKIN, who was stopped as a tourist while shopping in Akihabara at the time of this story , says

・・・・
I indicated to the officers that I actually did have a knife, and displayed the tool to them. I was courteously informed that carrying a knife of any type or size anywhere in Japan was not permitted. I had no idea.

I offered the officers the small tool, explaining that I had no real attachment to the thing, nor any significant investment in it, as it was purchased for about $4.99 at Wal Mart. Again, in a very courteous manner, the officer simply reiterated the violation, refused to take the tool, and told me to put it in my pocket until I was back in Niigata, put it my suitcase once I was there, and, not remove it until I had cleared Japanese airspace.・・・・

The Japanese police “can” be nasty, but that’s more like the Japanese police I know.
And I am with Alex, who who says,

I cannot even imagine that a police officer would ask someone “Do you have a pocket knife?” in response to the question “Where is Kinokuniya?”

And yes I am still waiting for the full story too.

The family on the train being fined is a different matter. The fine is simply there to create revenue, I assume they were not arrested or anything.

No one is debating a law was broken. But it seems like the way it was handled by the Japanese police might be very unusual.

Ditto the guy drinking in the US. I would of course also think the cop was a shithead, but realistically, ignorance of the law has never been an excuse.

If I buy a kitchen knife in kappabachi (tokyo) and carry it in my backpack to my hotel room, do I risk something ?

If you have nothing to hide, still it is possible that the test is invalid, but that possibility is quite low.
If you take the test, it won’t take time.
If you decline, that makes the police more suspicious because this kind of things only happen in a very specific circumstance. That might make the police ask more questions and in an extreme case they might arrest you for obstructing the official business or disorderly conduct or whatever by nitpicking you. You might be released later, but that is a waste of time.
And I doubt American citizens complying with the police in a case like this have caused the authority to “do with respect to eavesdropping, border searches of electronics, etc”.

That’s my evaluation and I know different people will make different calculations.
And you are right. People have the right to decline and I respect their choice.

Would you be saying the same thing if a 74 year old Japanese man was arrested and thrown in jail for drinking a beer in public while on vacation in the US? Would you be telling the outraged Japanese public they should shut up and follow the law in other countries? Or would you agree that it’s an overreaction on the part of the police and never should have happened?

On a train in Italy I saw a Japanese family being fined for not having stamped their ticket. Guess it’s entirely their fault for not knowing all the rules, right?

A simple defense is there a friggin Victorinox shop in Osaka.
They do not sell their knives to be put on display on a shelf in a glass box in your home. If you’re not going to carry it, there’s no point in owning it, and no point in them being sold.

If you arrest me for having the perfectly legal knife, you’d better close down that shop and make Swiss Army Knife sales illegal in Japan.
Even though we can still buy giant kitchen knives in any 100 yen across the country.

The law clearly states that you can carry a knife “with good reason”, but doesn’t define what “good reason” is.
Unfortunately, it means the cops can probably decide whatever definition they want. Rationally, if you say anything other than “I will stab people by the light of the full moon until the voices, THE VOICES stop!!!”
Then you aren’t breaking the law.

I’m glad this old guy was stubborn enough to not sign a friggin confession for such a petty “crime”, especially since, as an American, he was probably thinking that certain rights against search without a warrant nor just cause should be universal in any civilized country with basic human rights. That he would win such a case if it went to trial. And that a “justice” system and police that try to force you to sign a confession should be viewed with suspicion at the very least.

Japan’s jsutice system is not so civilized. At least the lay judge system is a step in the right direction. Next step, how about some accountability?

But i suppose it CAN be used as a weapon, so everyone who ever goes to japan should assume they aren’t allowed to carry them. Assuming that everyone that ever leaves their country is a lawyer who speaks the native language and thus can “know the laws.” I mean, otherwise it’d be pretty difficult to become completely versed in a foriegn countrys particular laws just for a 14 day stay.

Of course since knives are illegal, I’m assuming the same logic gets applied to forks. And pencils/pens. And keys. And nail files. And skateboards. And anything else that could possibly be used to inflict harm on someone.

Perfectly sensible.

it is never, ever a good idea to sign a legal paper without knowing what it said. However surely sometime within 10 days someone – a lawyer, the son, the Embassy rep who visited – could have convinced him that it was OK to sign a piece of paper saying he was wrong and sorry about the whole mess.

Assuming that this was the reason the police kept holding him right up until the deadline that they had to either formally charge him or else release him, I am not sure we can entirely blame the police. If indeed they were providing a get-out-of-jail-free card, and this gentleman was not taking it, then he is as much to blame as the police.

I agree that it would always be bad to sign something you do not understand. Obviously during the 10 days no one made it clear to him that this was the thing to do. But is it really the proper thing to do? Would admitting guilt give you a criminal record? As it is he was released and not convicted of anything. I know I would certainly be nervous about admitting guilt especially if my lawyer was telling me I should never have been arrested. Again we don’t really know any details here so its hard to speculate. Either the guy did not sign out of ignorance, or he did not sign because he did not believe he was guilty. Hopefully we will hear more later.

I’m still curious to know if his lawyers statements are fact. That he should never have been arrested and should have only been questioned and had his knife confiscated. I seem to recall a little while after the stabbings in Akihabara the police randomly questioned people and ending up confiscating pocket knives that were against the law. I never heard of any arrests during that time so it makes me believe that maybe the lawyer is telling the truth.

I’m putting my money on the cop was an a-hole for now based on what I’ve heard.

“I seriously doubt the man needed to be detained at all,” said lawyer Kazuharu Suga, who has been assigned to defend the American.

“Police should have confiscated the knife and released him after getting answers for why he came to Japan, where and how long he plans to stay in Japan and how he got the knife,” Suga said.

So assuming his lawyer is telling the truth then there must be something we are not hearing about. Or like I suggested earlier he just got the wrong cop at the wrong time. No matter how perfect anyone might believe Japan to be, I am willing to bet there are douchebag cops in every country in the world. So maybe this cop was an asshole and decided to have fun with this guy. Would be nice to at least hear an explanation from the arresting officer as to why he got such harsh treatment.

I can’t say I blame the guy for being reluctant to sign a document that he cannot read after being arrested for such a minor offense. I mean yea it’s probably the standard thing to do or whatever but how does he know that? For all he knew he could have been looking at a long prison sentence if he signed a document.

You can repeat the he “he broke the law” thing until you are blue in the face. But it looks like he may not have gotten the type of treatment that he should have. Until we hear more details it certainly looks like these cops probably owe that poor guy an apology at least.

Anyways, as I tried to say, I agree with you and thanks for the story – I think I remember hearing something about this now.

But the “nothing to hide nothing to fear” line of thought can be potentially dangerous in the long run. perhaps…

Would be nice if this was a world where the police would not try to operate beyond their powers.

the main flaw with this whole affair is right in this quote:

“The problem is that prosecutors and judges do not think independently. They don’t question what police bring them,” …”The judicial procedure is often automatic, and of course can be unfair to suspects.”.”

Some of the “irrelevant details” people are “quibbling” over are very relevant. The “whoops, I was an idiot, sorry” form I mentioned earlier (which is effectively the same as the citation pixel_bomber mentions) may be the crux of the reasoning behind the 10-day all-expenses-paid stay at the Hotel Folsom this gentleman got. Brian Hedge did say his understanding, based on what the son supposedly told him, was the cops kept trying to get him to sign the form and he kept refusing. Now, granted, it is never, ever a good idea to sign a legal paper without knowing what it said. However surely sometime within 10 days someone – a lawyer, the son, the Embassy rep who visited – could have convinced him that it was OK to sign a piece of paper saying he was wrong and sorry about the whole mess.

Assuming that this was the reason the police kept holding him right up until the deadline that they had to either formally charge him or else release him, I am not sure we can entirely blame the police. If indeed they were providing a get-out-of-jail-free card, and this gentleman was not taking it, then he is as much to blame as the police.

That was one point I was really, really hoping the JT article would clarify. But they disappointed yet again.

I do agree with you that if you are doing nothing wrong, it is best to cooperate, but I am sure you also realize that this attitude can be dangerous in the long run… perhaps.

“If you have nothing to hide you have nothing to fear.”

I sat in awe at what the Bush administration wanted to do/did do with respect to eavesdropping, border searches of electronics, etc.

The tourist did break a law. Ignorance of a law does not excuse acting in an illegal manner. However, the choice of what to do with someone who has unknowingly broken a foreign law is completely up to the officer. The police officer could have easliy confiscated the knife and let the man go, as the lawyer suggested and as has happened to other commentors on this story.

Legally, the tourist did wrong by breaking the law of the country he was in. Ethically, the Japanese legal system did wrong by incarcerating a man for 10 days who did not deserve such treatment.

Seems pretty clear-cut. Know the laws of the country you visit and abide by them, or risk getting arrested for breaking the law.

Personally, I think it’s a perfectly sensible law.

違法捜査裁判：「任意捜査の範囲を逸脱」と都に賠償命令

　公務執行妨害罪などに問われ無罪が確定した横浜市の男性が、警視庁の違法な逮捕で精神的苦痛を被ったとして、東京都に約９４０万円の賠償を求めた訴訟の判決で、東京地裁は２２日、９７万円の支払いを命じた。畠山稔裁判長は「２時間を超える職務質問をしており、任意捜査で許される範囲を逸脱している」と逮捕手続きを違法と判断した。

　判決によると、男性は０６年３月、世田谷区の路上で３時間半にわたる職務質問を受け、逃走しようと車を発進させてドアミラーを警察官にぶつけたうえ、トランク内に大麻を持っていたとして、公務執行妨害と大麻取締法違反の疑いで現行犯逮捕された。しかし、東京地裁は同１０月、「男性にぶつける故意はなく、公務執行妨害罪は成立しない。逮捕手続きが違法なため、見つかった大麻にも証拠能力はない」と無罪判決を言い渡し、２審で確定した。【伊藤一郎】
毎日新聞　2009年7月22日

Nontheless, I’d still suggest to comply with the police if he/she had nothing to hide, considering the time and troubles it might take if she/he declined. Or rather, I’d suggest not to go to the places where crimes rates are high.

Now of course, just because you have the right to do so, doesn’t mean it would be the smartest course of action.

You would be basically forcing the cops to either arrest you or let you go. I do not know which is more likely to happen.

In the case of those guys in Roppongi that failed an on the stop UA, it would have been best for them to decline the test, but I am assuming they didn’t know they could do that. If they were then arrested and tested, it would be very interesting to see how the whole thing would have played out in court, which would likely depend on the believability (to the lay judges) of the justification for arrest.

If you are detained, ask to call the lawyer or the embassy.
If you are a resident and frequently stopped by the police, work with the local people and the police to prevent it.
Confronting the police is not always the best way.

Obviously we can’t expect a tourist to know this, but anyone reading this blog should…

Regardless, in Japan you don’t just wander around with a knife, no matter if the blade is under or over 5 cm. You are supposed to have a reason for carrying a knife, and “keychain/watch fob/accessory/netsuke” is not a “reason”.

All of that said, 10 days is ridiculous. I believe Brian Hedge said part of the problem was that the police wanted the man to sign the usual “I’m sorry I screwed up, but I have reflected on what I have done and won’t do it again” but he wouldn’t. If he had, he may well have been released the same day or perhaps the next day. Too bad the Japan Times did not clarify this, it might make the actual circumstances behind why the man was held for 10 days clearer.