Takeshima / Dokdo dispute flares up again
When the Japanese government released an official instruction manual recommending that middle schools teach children about the territorial dispute over the Liancourt Rocks, it was very careful in its wording:
While the manual describes the Russian-held northern territories as an “integral part of our country’s territory” and states they are “unlawfully occupied” by Russia, the ministry decided to avoid using similar expressions in respect of Takeshima, which is also a disputed territory, in consideration of South Korea’s feelings.
South Korea, which has included heavy propaganda about the islets in its school lessons for years, reacted with rage towards Japan. The South Korean government recalled its ambassador, protesters hurled eggs and tomatoes at the Japanese embassy in Seoul, ads for Japanese products were pulled from the Seoul subway system, and at least one sick child was ignored by a brain dead nationalist parent. South Korean President Lee Myung-bak has vowed to take “strategic counter-measures” against Japan’s territorial claim.
A protester with a sign in Japanese proclaiming that Korea is Dokdo territory.
Oh Young-jin (foolsdie@koreatimes.co.kr), assistant managing editor of the Korea Times, wrote an opinion piece urging resistance against Japan:
For the rest of the world, it should be kept in mind that Korea is the first line of defense and offense, and that if it crumbles, it would soon be the turn of other countries.
How should Japan respond? The Asahi’s English edition ran a very good editorial the other day about the current flare up in the dispute over the Liancourt Rocks:
The manual issue amounts to nothing more than a rehash of the Japanese government’s official stand on the Takeshima issue. In fact, existing textbooks from four publishers already contain passages on Takeshima. The great majority of Japanese citizens hope to maintain good bilateral ties. Tokyo should seize every opportunity to explain this fact clearly and patiently to Seoul.
We can appreciate South Korea’s anger. But that said, it is also a fact that the manual states objectively that South Korea and Japan have always been at odds over Takeshima’s ownership.
Both sides should present their arguments, agree to disagree, and try to resolve the dispute calmly. That is the only way to go.
The Japanese government has taken just such a position, urging calm and calling for a peaceful resolution of the dispute.
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Perhaps we should let North Korea use the islands as an atomic test site so they can blow them up!
Never mind, within 50 years China will rule the whole region anyway as they beleive that Korea is as much a part of China as Tibet is.
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I know coming from a small nation like Japan, its hard for a Japanese to understand that a country as vast as China doesnt have the wish to extend its territory cos its already really really big. Unlike the Japanese, we r 100% satisfied with the land we r currently owning.
Actually, China is claiming the HISTORIACAL land of Korea(Goryeo ~920) which now de facto is Chinas territory. China is NOT claiming the current NK+SK territory.
On the other hand, Korea is claiming that the current chinese territory (North China, Manchuria, 80% Han population) belongs to Korea cos it was korean some 1000 years ago.
Now to Takeshima / Dokdo:
Lots whities think Dokdo r just tiny shitty rocks.
Now, the truth is :
The area disputed between SK/Japan & Japan/China is supposed to be full of natural recources like oil/gas just waiting to get dig out.
Japan is claiming the islands cos through that method, Japan can strech its see border far far beyond what it normally would own due to international law. By stretching its see border into its neighboring country, it can plunder the recources to its maximum.
Japan is not the peaceloving big eyed victim its portraying itself. Its doing what the US is doing, securing recource rich area.
In the case of Korea, Korea is not as nealy frightening as China, so Japan does not gives much what Korea wants.
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Oh, its not like China didnt/doesnt have territorial conflicts with neighbours like India and Vietnam right?
Not even mentioning the Taiwan, Tibet, Senkakus Conflicts.
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Territorial conflicts between India/China & Vietnam/China is settled.
Tibet belongs de facto to China. Saying there is a
territorial conflict is like saying there is a
territorial conflict between England and North irland or the Scots.
Just because whities cant accept that Tibet is within Chinas border now, it does not mean its not part of China, at least for now.
Taiwan is a wanna be independant candidate. If China is Serbia, no prob. Unfortunate for them, they r dealing with China. Just like unfortunate for Iraqis, they r dealing with the US. So, both big fat bullies arent going to loose their grips anytime soon.
What i was trying to say is that territorial conflicts are often more about resources fighting than history or pride sh*t. Nations just invent excuses to make themselves look good when the real reason behind those conflicts r often nothing more than greed.
In order to keep the own population on the govs side, its essencial to come up with something ppl agree with & can be passionate about.
The US came up with human rights & democracy;
the Chinese with history;
the Koreans with pride
+ history;
the Japanese with victimnisation.
I am just fed up with the Japanese pretending to be the good guys being victims of Koreans.
Its like saying the US is the real innocent victim in the Iraq war.
Ever wonder why Japan never got any support from southeast asian nations when those things happens?
You think Koreans/Chinese r the only one being pissed of about comfort woman/textbook and so on?
Vietnamese, Indonesians, Singaporean… r also pissed off, but their voice r overheard cos they r for JP not as important as their direct neighbors SK&CN.
JP is the cute little anime nation in the eyes of whities. But between JP and the ASEANS there is stil lots of hatred & dislike going on. Whities just dont sense this emotions cos ppl keep this to themselves.
Only the Koreans/Chinese r freak out enough to openly show their dislike for JP, while the rest just hide their dislikes much better and deeper.
If u r white, ur skin colour is reason enough to keep the mouth of most asean ppl shut regarding what they really feel.
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“What i was trying to say is that territorial conflicts are often more about resources fighting than history or pride sh*t. Nations just invent excuses to make themselves look good when the real reason behind those conflicts r often nothing more than greed.”
- I agree with you on that man.
“In order to keep the own population on the govs side, its essencial to come up with something ppl agree with & can be passionate about.
The US came up with human rights & democracy;
the Chinese with history;
the Koreans with pride
+ history;”
- Basing on what I’ve observed so far, I agree.
“the Japanese with victimnisation.”
- I would disagree here. The Japanese aren’t acting like victims. That’s because they’re actually victims in a way. I mean, I’m sure a lot of people remember the violent anti-Japan riots of several years ago, where Japanese businesses in China got attacked and all that, add to that all this anti-Japan sentiment in Korea, with these displays of nationalism. Ironically, such events don’t hurt the image of Japan overseas. In fact it makes people more sympathetic towards Japan. It’s like Korea and China, at their own expense, giving free international sympathy to Japan. Maybe that’s why Japan isn’t complaining despite all of these things happening.
“I am just fed up with the Japanese pretending to be the good guys being victims of Koreans.”
- Like I said man, they’re not pretending or anything. It’s the angry nationalistic Chinese and Koreans that are making Japan look good.
“Its like saying the US is the real innocent victim in the Iraq war.”
-Sorry dude, comparing US-Iraq to Japan-Korea doesn’t work here. Although I’m not familiar with the specifics of the Japanese occupation of Korea, the fact that the occupation of Korea happened more than half a century ago, Koreans (and Chinese for that matter) should just learn to let go. I mean, come on. The current Japan is worlds apart from the Japan of WWII, especially ideologically. They’re no longer a country filled with extreme right wingers. And all the WWII guys are already dead or too old already. Just move on. I’m SE Asian and our country got murdered, raped, plundered, etc by Japan as well, but we’ve moved on. Fact is, your typical person here actually likes and respects Japan and he’d also have quite a positive opinion of Japanese. I mean, we don’t forger what happened in the past, we still teach WWII events in school, and we have also have grandparents who got bayoneted, raped, etc, but we don’t wallow in it. I mean, more than half a century has passed since WWII already man, just let it rest.
“Ever wonder why Japan never got any support from southeast asian nations when those things happens?”
- Here’s my opinion as a SE Asian. SE Asian countries are typically small and poor, with negligible influence (well, at least compared to the Asian behemoths like China and Japan for instance). As such SE Asian governments tend to just sit in the corner and hope no one notices ‘em. If they don’t support Japan, then that’s more because they’re afraid of the consequences of “supporting” Japan than anything else. I don’t think our bureaucrats fancy the idea of economically strong China or Korea breathing down on their necks.
“JP is the cute little anime nation in the eyes of whities. But between JP and the ASEANS there is stil lots of hatred & dislike going on. Whities just dont sense this emotions cos ppl keep this to themselves.”
- Like I mentioned man. Your typical person here doesn’t hate Japan at all. Not sure about the other SE Asian countries though. Although I would guess that most of SE Asia has already moved on more or less. It’s probably only just China and Korea wallowing in all this hate.
“Only the Koreans/Chinese r freak out enough to openly show their dislike for JP, while the rest just hide their dislikes much better and deeper.”
- Sorry man. No hate here. I suggest cooling down as well man. It feels better than having all that hate.
“If u r white, ur skin colour is reason enough to keep the mouth of most asean ppl shut regarding what they really feel.”
- Not true. Everyone’s entitled to an opinion. Personally, I’d very much welcome a Westerner’s point of view since they can look at things from an outsider’s point of view.
-Anyway, sorry for the long post. To my Chinese and Korean friends, I suggest letting go of all the hate. It feels much much better that way. Thanks.
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Firstly, why do you assume I am white?
Secondly, I didnt dream the vietnamese student protests against China some months ago, I think. The conflict about the Senkakus isnt settled, neither are Chinas conflicts with India over territory, its just not a hot topic discussion or will lead to a war or something, just like the sachalin, senkakus, takeshima/dokdo, etc. conflicts.
Now, assuming its indeed boundaries and resouces that play a factor for the claims, who does this make Japan any different from the other “players” in comparable reasons, thus why dont you equally condemn the koreans, chinese, etc.?
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Bye the way, to add some content
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Disputed_territories
Theres even “a Dokdo” for Chinese to haggle over with the Koreans:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Suyan_Rock
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Bout that time again for the Dokdo fanaticism, hey? I like these kinds of stories, because they come at regular intervals and allow me to confirm the accuracy of my calendars.
After Dokdo loses its steam again, they’ll jump back into demanding apologies for comfort women, and when that loses its steam, they’ll jump back into History textbooks, and continue the cycle.
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These people are insane. “The first line of offense and defense..”? What on Earth are these people thinking? Their perspectives are so incredibly skewered that they can barely fathom the reality that the occupation of Korea is indeed no longer taking place. Its as if they are fighting against the old Japan which has for good reason seen its last. Why neglect your children in order to slash at ghosts?
I am very worried for the mental health of these people. Dokdo/Takeshima are rocks, people. Rocks. Share the fishing around them.
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Korea is Dokdo territory.
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TIME PARADOX!
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i think it’s part of Korea
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I think it’s not my problem. Looks like rocks to me.
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Dang! I forgot to go and sell flammable/edible Japanese flags to the Koreans to burn/chew on in their raging protests again!
Oh well maybe next time. Maybe I should prepare stocks of photos of various government leaders too for good measure.
Oh, and first aid kits too, in case they accidentally bite their fingers off or set themselves on fire…
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Korean fanaticism was somえthing to be expected. Their mindset was frozen from 1930s. (Well, they were actually Japanese back then, but let’s forget about it.)
What I don’t understand is the attitude of Japanese government. If they do claim Liancourt, then why don’t they write it clearly? Isn’t it yet another “brainwashing of history (TM)”? Or do they think Russia, the former Cold War enemy with atomic weapons, is less scary than South Korea?
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Why do you say Koreans were Japanese in the 1930s?
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What I don’t understand is your comment. It’s all over the place.
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Sorry, but I don’t understand your comment. Could you clarify what is “all over the place”?
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Seriously, all this trumped up Korean nationalism recently only points to one thing for a cynic like me..
there must be something fundamentally wrong that the Korean government wants the Korean people to be distracted from.
Maybe gas prices? Energy prices? Economic slowdown?
Just inflame nationalist passions and all the protests end up being against them damn foreigners rather than the Korean government.
Koreans are a bunch of thick-skulled stoogers even more racist than Japanese people.
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Month+ long beef protests?
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Are they even more racist than American people?
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Everybody is a little bit racist….
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I disagree completely.
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Some Korean protesters defacing Japanese flags (warning: graphic images)
http://www.moneytoday.co.kr/view/mtview.php?type=1&no=2008071718190781431
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Dear lord.. those people are incredibly sick. This kind of behavior is absolutely disgusting. These individuals make Korea look like a nation of idiots. I really hope that moderate voices take control of the dialogue back from these maniacs. If they had their way they would go to war over these rocks in a pond.
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This is a small gift for USA & South Korean government from Japan!
Korean people will forget about BSE beef issue.
President Lee may be recovered from low popularity.
Anti-JP is the best way to divert Korean people’s attention from other issues.
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Oh shit, I thought BSE was a small gift for Japan, since it diverted Korean people’s attention from Japan. Now as expected, it seems they started using hate-Japan policy again. Look at them, they seem to be really having a good time as usual in protesting in hatred.
Matsuri da!? (It is time for a festival)
Korea is a great country that, based on myths and fancy talks, is able to give its people the meaning of life……When does the candle festival begin?
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Koreans are funny people. Its Japanese. Let the International Court Of Justice decide the matter. Take it to court. It is not Japan which is reluctant to settle this dispute over an international court. Could be worse. Imagine if Japanese and Koreans were like Americans. Ther would be all these new Guatanamos. This would be the so-called war on error. Be invading each other countries and their leaders would be ranting. Either you are with us or against.
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They were killing the symbolic birds of JP (pheasant) in front of JP embassy in Seoul on 2008/07/18.
It’s crazy!!!!!
http://ime.nu/image.moneytoday.co.kr/extern/2008/07/2008071718190781431_1.jpg
http://ime.nu/image.moneytoday.co.kr/extern/2008/07/2008071718323533247_1.jpg
http://ime.nu/www.moneytoday.co.kr/view/mtview.php?type=1&no=2008071718190781431
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They were killing the symbolic birds of JP (pheasant) in front of JP embassy in Seoul on 2008/07/18.
It’s crazy!!!!!
http://ime.nu/image.moneytoday.co.kr/extern/2008/07/2008071718190781431_1.jpg
http://ime.nu/image.moneytoday.co.kr/extern/2008/07/2008071718323533247_1.jpg
http://ime.nu/www.moneytoday.co.kr/view/mtview.php?type=1&no=2008071718190781431
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They were killing the symbolic birds of JP (pheasant) in front of JP embassy in Seoul on 2008/07/18.
It’s crazy!!!!!
http://ime.nu/image.moneytoday.co.kr/extern/2008/07/2008071718190781431_1.jpg
http://ime.nu/image.moneytoday.co.kr/extern/2008/07/2008071718323533247_1.jpg
http://ime.nu/www.moneytoday.co.kr/view/mtview.php?type=1&no=2008071718190781431
It’s easy to image what the kind of people will do in war.
Both of us deserve each other!!!!! WWWWW
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It’s easy to image what the kind of people will do in war.
Both of us deserve each other!!!!! WWWWW
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Education is the most important method to create beautiful future!
http://briandeutsch.blogspot.com/2008/06/those-who-cant-do-teach-those-who-cant.html#links
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Stop the hate! Learn to love!
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worry about something that matters, like the fact that both nations are creating another generation of minds mired in petty territorial disputes and filled with useless anger.
l-a-m-e
but typical for for such country-folk
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Politicians are stupid! They just care about the past to feed their national pride, things that is good for old generation who suffered during the war and colonization because it means that they are not being forgotten; however, that is not good for new generation because they are not part of that problem, and they should not pay for what the older generation of two nations did and suffered in the past. The two countries should look foward for a new relationship Japan-Korea in order to make both nation and people prosperous.
If Korea and China put their sentiment toward the past agression from Japanese side always, they will never improve their nation.
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dokdo island has A LOT of rich natural resources ‘hidden’. it was south korea’s to begin with but japan is just greedy and controlling like they were in the past. i dont think U.S. is to be trusted anymore, or at least i dont even know anymore. even though it looks like bunch of plain old rocks, this issue is important to koreans and japanese. im assuming this situation will cause war between south korea, japan, and US in the future. lets hope not.
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wow….as an American uni student studyin all of the interactions and conflicts between Japan, China, and Korea, its really interesting to read all of this.
However, can I ask why there seems to be this racism going on here from the Koreans? Why do you keep calling us whitie? Im sorry, I didnt realize you were still our little-yellow friends… Hmmm, can we try to get past the racist horse sh-t and just respect each other a bit?? Your Korean, Im American, the other guys Japanese etc. etc. etc. You sound really stupid calling all westerners whitie…
As for the Dokdo islands, my answer to this problem is the international standards of warfare and the rules inherent with either winning or losing said war. Realistically, when Japan lost World War II, it lost its Empire, which consisted of all lands siezed by Japan as a part of their expansionist movements of the late 19th and early 20th centuries. Now, I dont know the specifics for this in particular, but if Dokdo was seized by Japan during that period and not before, then it reverted properly to Korea. However, if Japan took those islands before it took Korea or Taiwan, then those islands are not considered a part of the expansionist Japanese Empire and thus would not have been severed from Tokyo as a part of the occupation.
Anyways, look at it this way, if Japan really really wanted those islands, they would take them from you. Its that simple, if youve done your studies, you know that the S. Korean navy cant hold a candle to Japan’s MSDF. So I guess we all just get to see a very controversial issue between two ancient, and in my opinion amazing, civilizations play out. Good luck to all of you, and seriously about the whitie thing, dont be such an ignorant sounding git.
Oh and about the Japanese victimization thing, look at the way Japans neighbors act towards it, last time I checked every nation changes their text books to make themselves look better, Korea and China are no different, they just do it to different things…
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Just step out of this matter if u don’t know anything
How would u feel if one of ur great grand mother and father
treated real badly from Japan? I mean not just humiliating-
murdered or forced to be a comfort women etc.
Wouldn’t you feel frustrated? Would you be able to love them?
I’m Korean and I’m not generalizing.
You guys are talking as if it was about 5 decades ago and
underestimating half a century, but man.
Believe me, half a century is nothing. That is just my great grand mother’s generation and she is still alive.
So what? if Koreans acting like a victim when they are
ACTUALLY a victim. I disgusts me when somepeople say that.
Somepeople might say “why don’t you just let it go?”
but it’s Japanese who should let it go.
You didn’t properly tied the knot. You didn’t sincerely
apologized to us.
So what if you’re disgusted by Koreans who acts like victim(whether it is true or not)
At least nothing happen to you.
but something happened which makes Korean people frustrate and me.
And yet Japan is here again to claim the ownership of Dokdo or Takeshiiiima or what ever they call it.
The reason why we can’t move on is because nothing is happening.
Come on. Japanese politicians, we don’t need your money.
We just need your sincere apology. Like German did to Jews.
of course apology doesn’t make up
for everything. but wouldn’t that at least change attitude
a little towards the future relationship?
If you don’t mind some Korean hating you or whatever,
why do you care?
If you don’t mind about that little rock,
why do you bother to claim that its yours?
You are having “Ok, why not giving it to them?” attitude
but there is sirious misunderstanding.
You are not GIVING it to us. You are just saying sorry
for what you have done wrong.
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